Discussion about this post

User's avatar
Noah Otte's avatar

I appreciate and enjoyed this article by Quinn Que, but I must disagree with it overall. I don’t disagree with him on everything he says. He makes good points here and there. I agree that some of the folks criticizing this film are doing so in bad faith or out of racism or transphobia, that some of this criticism specifically by the right, is reactionary and jumping the gun, that stories or tales can be reimagined for other times and places, and The Critical Drinker’s take on the new version of The Odyssey wasn’t very thoughtful. However, there are many problems with this article. The first three examples that Quinn Que gives for films not needing to be accurate in their telling of a story and that they can be remained by film makers for other times, audiences or cultures don’t work. Yes, it is true that Akira Kurosawa based Ran and Throne of Blood off King Lear and Macbeth. But the crucial difference that Quinn overlooks is that those were set in Japan with Japanese characters. Christopher Nolan is taking American characters and vernacular and bizarrely sticking them in Ancient Greece. If Nolan wants to make a version of The Odyssey reimagined for modern-day America and in American vernacular then it needs to be set in modern-day America NOT Ancient Greece.

It also makes zero sense to have to have black, Latino or Asian actors in movie set in Ancient Greece when all those groups either would’ve been rare or didn’t exist at all in Ancient Greece. Nor does it make a lick sense to have a trans character in the movie when there was no such thing as a trans person in Ancient Greece. The first sex change operation wasn’t performed until 1931. While having a transgender character in a modern day American retelling of Homer’s classic take makes sense, it looks silly and out of place in a story set in Ancient Greece. Having Travis Scott a modern American rap artist, in a movie set in Ancient Greece is also silly and out of place. I would also argue there is a BIG difference between modern day rap and hip hop and the style of music that bards sang back in ancient times. As to Quinn’s example of Alain Chabat’s film Astérix & Obélix: Mission Cléopâtre, it also falls short. This is because keep in mind it’s a comedy, it’s not meant to be serious. In a film that is not meant to be serious you can get away with being inaccurate. But not in a serious film that is meant to be serious attempt at a retelling of The Odyssey. As to the Ten Commandments it was back in 1956. It was a VERY different time in Hollywood when no one cared about accurate representation of other races or cultures. Also, while many critics might be hypocritical or bigoted in their criticism, the overall idea that the source material should be respected and that it makes no sense to cast actors of color and trans actors in Ancient Greece still stands. I understand what Quinn is saying in the anachronism section. But still, it is downright bizarre to hear modern-day American lingo in Ancient Greece. Elizabethan English may not be accurate for Ancient Greece either but it would go better with an Ancient Greek epic that modern American English would because the former is closer to the way in which Homer and his contemporaries spoke in that it sounds more sophisticated and intelligent. Regardless of what translation source he may have used and while Nolan’s film is not deliberate woke propaganda, definitely appears that way because of the choices he made with casting and dialogue. While it was indeed a rumor that Elliott Page was playing Achilles, he should not be in the movie as once again, it makes no sense at all to have a trans character in an Ancient Greek epic in a time when transgender as a medical and social concept didn’t exist. This is not to say people who crossed gender boundaries, lived as another sex, or did not conform to male/female roles didn’t exist in Ancient Greece. They absolutely did, but there was no one who could be called “transgender” living back then. You are imposing a modern concept onto the past there. Something else Quinn fails to mention is how poorly Christopher Nolan has handled the criticism. He has mocked his critics and acted like all critiques of the movie are just from racists, internet trolls and right-wingers. He refuses to accept any criticism of his film as legitimate.

Andy's avatar
Jul 16Edited

I won’t watch The Odyssey because:

- I care about historical accuracy.

- I think source material should be respected.

Anyone who cares about these things will only tolerate a certain amount of artistic licence.

Fundamentally I don’t believe that Nolan has a reverence for the source material. My guess is that he wanted to make an epic adventure film then looked for source material to base it on.

Let’s face it. Most Americans don’t care about The Odyssey as a work of art. If they’ve paid $30 to watch it on a big screen, their measure of success is whether they’ve got their money’s worth through expensive production techniques. Storytelling takes second place.

I’ve watched Astérix & Obélix: Mission Cléopâtre - it’s one of my favourite films. It’s a daft comedy that doesn’t try to be anything else. It doesn’t take itself seriously and no-one took it seriously. It's like comparing apples with pears.

How about asking French people what they think of the 2023 film Napoleon and about the director Ridley Scott categorically poopooing concerns about historical accuracy - according to him, entertainment is all that counts.

..

What irks me most is the double standard.

21 more comments...

No posts

Ready for more?